Finding a Russian (Ukrainian) Wife: Travels, not Agency or Online Dating? Advantages & Disadvantages, Mistakes & Success Tips
November 1, 2006 — wonderlanderSuppose you’ve stuck your index into the map, arranged a secure stay and hopped on a plane. Where are you going to meet the girls - and how?
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Street
Here it’s not regarded as a seemly place for introductions. Who knows what these strangers turn out to be (both parties having their own reasons to beware of criminals or just spare their time from blind dates which prove blind alleys; especially that “interesting” folks of both sexes spend most their time otherwise than hitting the streets or drinking in parks). Well, YOU have got an advantageous excuse for getting in contact – as a foreigner in need of some help. Just mind courtesy formulae.
A dream plot: While she is fulfilling that famous Slavic hospitality (assuming you’ve invented a lengthy yet intriguing and not burdensome quest, and she has time to guide you along), you can develop a casual talk which is likely to involve personal issues as both of you would be eager to explore a foreign culture in each other’s person,.. and this interest evolves.
Main setback: what’s the chance of meeting an English-speaking AND single AND dateless AND decent girl, NOT opposed to a foreign relationship and relocation, JUST having some free time to follow your scheme straight ahead? Scarce it is!
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Leisure & Holiday
Russian women tend to go out with company. As for vacations, young girls travel with their parents or stay with their relatives, till they are handed over to boyfriends / husbands. Alternatively, for a time off (be it recreation, pastime or amusement) women of all ages flock together or tandem with friends. For making an acquaintance, such an environment appears more secure for the girl, yet makes her less approachable: you were not waited for, she can’t abandon the companions, and for both of you the context doesn’t allow enough concentration for significant communication. (Well, nevertheless, local young girls and young men practice meeting out as they are going two by two - and even dating so - purportedly to reduce anxiety, or, since the method rather raises it, at least to have some party time.)
Still, with the social ways modernized, there comes a growing number of singles (and couples) spending time independently: “Why miss life’s entertainments for the only reason there’s no company available?” So when you see an unchaperoned lady enjoying her free time, this may be (a) just a nice single, unexpectful of or set out for romance – who-knows-how-serious-it-goes-but-family-ideals-kept-in-mind; (b) an engaged one, occasionally or temporarily going by herself; (c) a hunter by lifestyle, whatever it implies.
Main eye-opener: “International fit” and accessible Russian singles, be they serious women seeking foreign marriage, or sex touring girls, or ladies thinking pure refreshment and health improvement, careless if any dating occurs (still, prepared for giving it a try), - go on holidays abroad! Time is the first issue: holiday seasons are the first decade of May, then June - September (peak in August), and late December to mid-February. And there is a certain range of countries where Russian (Ukrainian) tourists concentrate.
Turkey, Bulgaria and Egypt are top three, as they offer better service at lower price than Former Soviet Union national resorts. The former two are especially favored by divorced mothers; Croatia appeals to party girls; Egypt, Cyprus, UAE, Tunisia attract more hookers.
Europe is magnetic to romantic girls and ladies of culture, with all its movie settings for their dreams of meeting the love of their lifetime. They are likely to be found in Italy, France, Spain, Britain, Greece (sightseeing & museums and/or beach destinations) in the warm season. Winter favorites are Czech, Slovakia, Hungary, Slovenia, Poland, France, Austria, Germany (excursions and/or skiing).
Peculiar are famous resorts fashioned by the Russian “new rich” (who have been crowding the Mediterranean, Alpine and Island regions for so long that the “glam vanguard” now head off to places where no Russian language is yet heard). Among the womenfolk, there are many “professional” golddiggers and few decent marriage-minded “elite”. Russian well-paid employees, managers and professionals are more like honestly looking for a worthy match. Rich daughters, business-ladies (often owing their shops and parlors to turnkey sponsorship), showbiz & media “stars” and starlets, “new Russian” ex-wives and girlfriends fall into both categories, in expectable proportion).
Of course you can find any motivation anywhere, the choice of place depending on the lady’s material standing, and her morals depending on the origin of this standing. E.g., London is reported quartered by a seasoned legion of “new Russian’s” girlfriends, nonchalant and bold, armoured in killing fashion clothes, threatening the native wives and brides. I’ll post more guidelines on behavior evaluation.
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Public facilities
With all aforesaid considerations to remember, you can improve the stakes a little bit: the context of the place may offer more time and ground for conversation, and somewhat specify the “target audience” (whose social background and occupation correlate considerably with education, culture, language and communication skills… with peculiarities still to be discussed). What would that be: an original foreign film show or a cultural event? a queue at a bank or a postal / Internet / call-center? a fitness club? a café in the office district?
Or why not try distract the friendly and attractive employees of foreigner-servicing tour agencies or medical facilities, as these are destined launching pads for getting married to a foreign man? ;) Imagine Plan A with the guide / interpretor which HAS to walk and talk with you all day round! (The only nuisance is that both of you are not the ones who choose each other…)
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Night clubs
From year one and throughout the Soviet era, dance grounds have been the Russian young people’s prime rendezvous, where everybody could express oneself and assess each other’s physical compatibility through dancing. Modern clubs have largely lost this primeval matching meaning, as most serious and cultured people, men or women, would avoid the atmosphere filled with smoke, spirit, loud music of two notes, and crowds of primitively-minded people often drunk or doped. Still, there is quite a number of good-taste houses and discos featuring oldies, rock, pop or ethnic music regularly, and it would be incorrect to label all the nightclubs as nests of vice. You can meet there students or white collars of all ages celebrating and unwinding, and girls of different backgrounds in the old-fashioned search of boyfriends worth becoming husbands, - each having her own face and manner distinguishable from the detached demonstrative style of hookers squirming near.
Main inconvenience of dancing houses: impossibility of communication through the music, making speech sound too primitive by form and essense even for initial acquaintance (if heard and understood at all). So, choose the club that has quieter bar / restaurant premises where you can offer your new dancing partner a refreshment pause, because suggesting a chill-out outdoors can be perceived as a dangerous and objectionable lead to premature intimacy.
To stand out, offer her not just “some drink”. Add juice, water, tea and coffee to the usual offer list of cocktail / wine / martini. No quiter halls? Ask if there is a cafe or restaurant nearby “to sit and talk”. You’ll show that you just care for her needs and take interest in her personality, rather than press on the pickup rituals. In turn, she would feel grateful and relaxed for not having to guess if you consider her obliged in case she accepts your offer and whatever she chooses. How she reacts and how the dance-floor acquaintances develop is a topic for a separate post…
To make the off-hand live-search venture pay its way, you need vast brackets of acceptance, extraordinary luck (or search at singles’ personals website to appoint dates where you go), true intuition and tremendous psychology skills (well, as anyway).
Then the brave enjoy the following advantages:
(1) You are a body ahead all online daters: you’re already here!
“Real life” acquaintance feels more binding than a “virtual” romance, where both parties are victims to the “Tamagochi Syndrome” (i.e. the correspondent always second to the calls of the day, and kept convenient in the digital cage).
(2) You two can use all of your senses to immediately learn each other.
DANGER! Researches have proven that the sight of beautiful women compromises men’s use of their intelligence. ;) And when there’s also voice, perfume and touch (I’ve heard that Russian accent is considered extremely sexy!) – reason is too often discarded. This is blatantly exploited by “bad girls”.
Safety guidance: Overhear the lust, and try to listen to your body for the sense of trust – that’s what you need this overall perception for. Well straightly speaking, need I remark that a marriage-ready man should be good at managing his way amidst female charms? (I didn’t mean the technique that might occur first!)
Luckily enough, you can take your time exploring each other’s inner world through emails, phone talks [skills permitting], and instant messenger chats as you come back home.
(Any reliance on SMS? Well it’s a good device for arrangements and romantic greetings, but too cumbersome for a substantial talk.)
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Web-paved way
Advertising your trip in a personal profile and/or communication should be put delicately. There are such common mistakes as bragging of the visit in the introduction (which suggests a “Mr Arrogant” or “Sex Tourist” image) and hasteful blunt demand to take some steps (same conclusion). The latter falls into two remarkable approaches.
(1) “Wanna-meet”: to answer this question, you must learn a bit about each other, so you both can guess if getting together is going to be interesting. It takes at least 15 minutes chatting, or a dozen lines of email / profile telling what the sudden friend you are.
(No haste with telephone - all information, and maybe even either party’s wits, could be lost in the unfamiliar speech! Besides, many important issues are what Russians may at their own discretion qualify as “non-phone talk”, or feel more comfortable to write than speak on with strangers. Ask what mode of communication she is more convenient with).
If not timely notified on the Distinguished Guest’s Exigent Visit, she might have set her own plans for these days… (Oh this “cute” habit of Monday-Thursday trips! If anybody didn’t know: these are work days here! Remember the vacation seasons as well - she may be leaving.) So, “best impromptus occur at the prepared stage”.
Joseph confirms: A month of corresponding before the visit is ideal to hold a woman’s attention.
(2) “Help-me-around”: caution should be taken not to cast an impression of some lazy exploiter not smart enough to type “Hotels” “[city]” in the search engine box. Apropos an ordinary Russian girl is not expected to be familiar with local hotels, unless her job presumes accommodating guests or she has helped your predecessors already (which suspicion usually mars impressions).
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Natalia’s Advise
The spontaneous mode of acquaintance between the foreign men visiting “Russia” (the Former Soviet Union) and the local women reduces both parties’ chances of meeting a decent partner. Why? Because the chance of making it a lasting relationship are fleeting, as the man is soon coming back West, to his own life. “How can a transient contact miles away compete with fellow-country men and women, how can people know each other enough to decide that one should cross her/his habitual life and start it all anew, in strange conditions?” - the girl reckons from her point of view. She has an option, to let guy go or to dead-set at him. The needy and the slutty would close in. The honest rather keeps aloof, presuming that the talk and fun underway are, at best, an unimportant pastime, or, at worst, “sex tourism to the savage land” (and so she thinks and acts to ward off “bad” men and prove “good” herself).
Sure you can find gems in dirt, wolves in lamb’s clothing, and innocent intentions in vigorous manner, - managing it all is still another topic. What is prerequisite, is
(1) some hasteless time - so that you both perceive each other clearly,
(2) a non-familiarizing manner - so that to look serious enough to get and hold a serious woman’s interest,
(3) balanced honesty in presentation to make her understand - that, why, and how, you are going to maintain communication,
and above all a sober mind and body to discern if you should.
Find your right way!
Sincerely,
© Comrade Natalia
(…please link to this page when using some information from it! ;)
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Seeking and offering the Supreme Values, are we gambling or investing? Let’s employ some economic vocabulary to construe love’s riddles…Basic 4 alternative methods of interaction get SWOT analysis here:
More focus on specific approaches to international dating:
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Traveling wild: the current post
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Expat work & business overseas: Pearl diving
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“Romance tour” socials: Meat Exchange, second-rate
- Dating sites: Art mart and its fakes
- Online communities: Exhibition catalogue
- Marriage agency: VIP salon approach
November 9, 2006 at 6:40 pm
So you beleive Natalia that corresponding to someone online first to at least better know them is still the best way to go?
Do you also recommend writing several ladies at one time or is it possible to find one and stick with her?
I have a difficult time with my conscience not sticking to one only. I know it has been advised that I not, but I am not comfprtable with more. Do I need to get over this or move as my spirit guides me?
I know it is my choice and I would not hold you to any comment. Just asking your opinion as a Russian woman. Am I seen as gullible or just a liar?
:)
Canajun
November 9, 2006 at 7:35 pm
Canajun, you are anticipating several posts I am going to explicate ))
First, love is communication, and survival in a new country is communication, - so if you want a wife as a friend not as a pet, you should look for a language-speaker. They flock at single dating resources or with Russian services for foreign guests, say, touring / interpreting bureaus.
Second, where a slightest language barrier exists, it is essential to find out decisive information without miscommunications, especially as they can be aggravated with sensual distractions. So, correspond!
Still, don’t linger on this stage, so that not to catch the Tamagochi Syndrom (C).
Methinks you feel what a normal decent man should feel. Give second chances to contacts not seeming very active (they may shoot suddenly) but don’t waste your time on what you feel not interesting. Otherwise you soon feel jaded and washed-out. Correspond with whom you want to correspond, - no more, no less. Your spirit is your ultimate guide, may you hear it all the way!
Sincerely, Natalia
November 12, 2006 at 7:04 pm
Do you perhaps have suggestions of places to seek where honesty and integrity may be of paramount concerns?
Canajun
:)
November 13, 2006 at 11:13 am
Before creating one, ;) I will do my best to provide you with sailing directions.
If only there were the Reserve of Honest People, I would have sought asylum there myself. )) Well, good news is that I often feel living in it, or at least serving as an Immigration Officer. Meaning that the people I meet in my life are prevalently honest, and wry ones can’t bear me long if not keep aloof. ))) Still, I process tons of information on raw deals and small daily policies to stay alert to “red flags” and evade what smells rat.
It is established in psychology and different philosophies that (1) people attract ones similar to themselves; (2) people attract situations they are afraid of, to learn to manage their lives.
So, I would observe all meeting places, suggest what women you can meet there, reveal all motivations they can have, and advice how you can scan them. These are my sailing directions, and your own desires, integrity, sincerity and intuition are at the steerwheel.
Sorry I can’t have it written all at once, - still have a job that claims me.
Promising new posts and old post updates,
Natalia
January 9, 2007 at 11:41 pm
A great bit of information to quote from GL’s.
visitor Says:
Regarding meeting women in Russia - one thing that might be useful to know, is that women do not generally go ‘out’ alone (i.e. to a club, bar, restaurant), at least in the evening.
It is not even common for them to go with another female friend. There is usually one or more guys with them. They will often ‘arrange’ a male friend to accompany (or deliver) them to the destination at the very least. It is not considered particularly safe for girls to to out at night alone. It is viewed as a welcome sign for kerb crawlers in cars [not only - any of street criminals as well. - N.O.] and is almost always avoided.
Meeting single women in bars etc. is possible, but they will most likely be with their brothers, friends (or boyfriends!) at the time, and if not, then they will most likely be collected by them later.
As an example: I now always accompany my wife’s female friends to/from a train/bus or drive them home in the evening after visiting, partly because it is a normal social gesture which they expect, and partly because of the issues mentioned above. This expectation is fairly common among Russian women.
I do extend exactly the same service to her local friends, which they do find surprising, but most have got used to the idea
I don’t want to exaggerate this issue too much - it is just what I understand of the culture there and is perhaps useful to know.
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wonderlander Says:
Well pointed. There exists a strong prejudice that a girl going out alone, or even eating out alone, is at danger, physically (depends on the crime rate in the neighborhood), and even to her reputation.
Things change in big cities, where you can rely on decent taxi service, and where oldie bans, at least the most “blue-law” ones, are fading away… however, many men cling to them, thinking “liberal” for fun, “canaries” for marriage (”canary” is an old slang word for home-kept very-mothered daughters), and so do many women, in order to ensure their respect, though they may be quite modest and self-preserving despite unlimited outlooks.
Which reduces chances… not totally, but substantially.
October 18, 2007 at 6:40 pm
My name is Hisham Ghali 46 years old looking for Russian girls ( 2 ) god looking, speak English if French as well will be a plus. They will work in Egypt, Taba in Radison hotel.
my mail ( Hisham.Ghali@radissonsas.com )
Please reply as sson as you can
Natalia: Answer no. With all my respect to the Radisson chain, this message looks too much like a beaten track to human trafficking. Even if it is legitimate employment, my profile is different - which is, facilitating secure marriages to Western men.
October 20, 2007 at 12:43 am
Aunt Natalia, you mentioned work as a way to meet good women. What about teaching English classes?? What percent would you say are single available women in that kind of a study group?? Would they think that a 24 year old male has no business teaching them??
I know, a lot of questions. Is your dating site up yet??
October 23, 2007 at 5:19 pm
I guess GL would call it a great idea, by his own experience. ) This group would abound with young single women, internationally-oriented and very likely prone to getting married abroad. (Though I can’t omit older women yearning to keep up with the modern standards of work skills.)
As a language teacher, you would be more than welcome, being a native English speaker with much youthful energy and charisma (I presume). On the more personal level, much socializing is guaranteed, largely for the fun of flirtation and shared pastimes, and for the interest in the mysterious foreign life they would want to learn about.
As for marriage prospects, I can’t predict their term. Today’s girls are not in a hurry, though they would not resist to a great love with a great man. In terms of potential family provider capacity, a corporate manager or expert has higher scores (local markets value foreign brains), but figuring out that you live not from the teacher’s salary is a sort of IQ test for the brides.
The site is approaching the launching pad. Some time is required to build the corporate structure, and to subscribe women. If nothing prevents, my American partner’s next visit to Ukraine is in November. We would travel a lot to scout for the better.
March 6, 2008 at 1:51 pm
i looking for Russian girls ,
for live and mirrage
Joseph to Natalia:
This message is the type of thing to be ignored. Short, rude and gramatically incorrect, it is probably what he would be like in real life. One of the troubling aspects of this business is the many Arabs who reside in America on green cards and reperesent themselves as just Americans to lure women here. They have to use the K1 visa like regular Americans and I have heard many stories of women abused by them. I understand why many women in their profiles specify no Arabs or Arab countries.
April 26, 2008 at 3:42 pm
Important information from GL’s “Good Way to Travel…” post & thread:
- on the value of interpreters
- on harmful mistakes in language (comments 6-10) and behavior (comments 19-21)
- on dancing out and its value for knowing a mate (comment 22 answered in 35-39)
with some more highlights on the ways of meeting people in general.
May 1, 2008 at 11:19 am
i really need a rich and good girl to be love by me.THANKS
Natalia: Please start with specifying who you are and why she should really need you. A level of English / French / German / Spanish / Italian, better than that you expect on her part, is required. Then welcome. )